Matt Reeves discusses Barry Keoghan’s character in The Batman

Matt Reeves has opened up about Barry Keoghan’s mystery character in The Batman as well as a deleted scene featuring him.

Please note spoilers follow from here. Do not read any further if you have not yet seen The Batman.

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Speaking with IGN, Reeves spoke about Barry Keoghan’s appearance in the film and a scene that was cut from earlier in the film.

“What’s interesting is that the reason that Joker’s in the movie is there was actually another scene that was earlier. And because the movie is not an origin tale for Batman, but it’s his early days, it really is an origin tale for the Rogue’s Gallery’s characters. And for me, I think [it’s] this idea that the Joker is not yet the Joker, but they already have this relationship.
“The scene that was not in the movie, the scene that this is really the companion to, which is actually a really cool scene that will release at some point, it’s a scene where Batman is so unnerved because the Riddler is writing to him. And he’s like, ‘Well, why is this guy writing to me?’ And he figures he’s got to profile this killer.”
“He goes to see another killer that he’s clearly had an experience with in these first two years. And this killer in this story is not yet the character that we come to know, right? So everybody’s in their infancy. So in the comics, these characters often declare their alter egos in response to the fact that there’s a Batman out there. And so here, we have a Joker who’s not yet the Joker.”

Will we eventually see him go full Joker? We'll just have to wait and see what happens.

The Batman is now in general theatrical release, and will arrive on HBO Max on April 19, 2022.

34 comments

Drake Grayson

March 4, 2022

I’d bet dollars to donuts we see that scene in Arkham show. Could be a great place for flashbacks. And… I expect Gordon to flashback on his relationship with Batman over their first 18 months together. They are full fledged trusting partners in the film, and I was surprised we never got a nod from Gordon on why and what they experienced together. Reeves is probably saving that for HBOMAX series.

Flower & Monster & Golden Calf
March 4, 2022
Yeah, I think this will tie into the HBO max show.
mrsomebody
March 5, 2022
Their trust was 100% on each other which I loved

Thanasis

March 4, 2022

Not a fan of the look of what we saw tbh.

Bruth Wayne

March 4, 2022

Not a fan of Joker being a known killer before becoming Joker.Just stick with TKJ origin.

Drake Grayson
March 4, 2022
Oh man, a 3rd thing we disagree on, lol. While I do like KJ, my favorite backstories for Joker are Mask of Phantasm and Batman Confidential, which borrowed and expanded on Hamill Joker origins imo. I love the idea of this lethal, fast, genius level assassin/heist planner/mob mercenary who gets bored with how easy crime is to him and almost feels lost and ready to give it all up until Batman comes along to give him a challenge and make his life purposeful.
1. Bruth Wayne
  March 4, 2022
  Nothing wrong with disagreeing when it comes from a place of passion and honesty. That leads to good discussions, and the lack of those things is the only reason I had issues with other people in their defense of certain films. The problem I have with the origins you mentioned or someone turning into Joker as a challenge is it isn't that different from other villains, many did it for the same reason. It makes Joker lose his uniqueness.
  IMO TKJ origin allows him to be a true dark reflection of Batman..someone poor (vs someone rich), who wasn't good at anything he tried (vs being good at everything he tried), was was always a patsy vs making plans, also losing his family. Bruce strengthened his mind and resolve while Joker lost his forever, perhaps by giving in. Batman has other mirrors (Wraith, Hush, Prometheus) but non as complete or important as Joker with TKJ origin IMO.
  1. Drake Grayson
    March 4, 2022
    Well said and all good points. I only made the comment because we seem to agree often on Batman related topics. BvS and Damian were only two we are far apart on iIrc. Now 3, but it’s always good to see well articulated conflicting opinions on a character and world so beloved.
    1. jrvc
      March 5, 2022
      yeah well, wait until you disagree hard with him, he wished me and my family dead by coronavirus a couple of times once he was out of arguments... And not counting the times he has changed his nicks just to insult other users around here
    2. Drake Grayson
      March 5, 2022
      I don’t want to speak for anyone else, but I’d like to believe everyone in the Bat fan community wishes nothing but health and happiness to you and your family. You have good input and insights and I respect your opinions.
    3. jrvc
      March 6, 2022
      Oh don't worry, but this guy is just... another kind of troll, I don't why he acts that way but okay. Thanks for saying that about my comments, I always try to be as unbiased as I can and try to not get angry with anyone around here (not even that guy could say I engaged on a toxic behaviour with him). I've been commenting here for years and that was the first time someone said sth like that to me, but the worst thing is that he has done it countless times to others but there is no moderators here so...
  2. TibzTheSecondComing
    March 7, 2022
    Pretty sure when we’ve disagreed you’ve made some very violent, racist and homophobic remarks.
    1. TibzTheSecondComing
      April 27, 2022
      Generally speaking yes and currently he’s under his “Bruth Wayne” guise.
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Darth Bane

March 4, 2022

He said that he was inspired by Conrad Veidt from The Man Who Laughs for this version of Joker which is very fitting and amazing.

Andrew

March 5, 2022

Was very disappointed that this scene was shoe horned in. Sure, maybe it fit better if that other scene was kept in, but it wasn’t. Just felt like it watered the movie and was a studio note rather than a conscious decision.

mrsomebody

March 5, 2022

That scene was awful. Out of place, terribly directed, terribly acted, distracting and unnecessary. That laugh was up there with Leto's as the joker. It felt so fake and there was no point to laugh so hard at the monolgue he had. Especially for the Riddler.
Just thinking about it gets me disappointed lol

Rust
March 7, 2022
I have to agree. So much of the movie was so well done that this stood out as such a negative sticking point for me by sheer contrast. It was incredibly cheesy and overplayed the tropes, cartoonifying both the Joker and the Riddler in an otherwise rather dark and grounded film.
It was part of what completely deflated the Riddler in the climax of the film for me - nail in the coffin, if I'm honest. I loved him up to the end, and then he fell apart narratively.
1. Drake Grayson
  March 7, 2022
  I was kinda disappointed Riddler allowed himself to be caught. Was it so he could have his fan boy “we’re a team” moment in Arkham(hell) with Batman? Was it because he needed his main base to be that apartment over looking perp walk for Falcone and he knew his identity would be found out then anyway? Or was it so he could meet an already incarcerated Joker to give audience a tease for epic team up to occur in future. I guess there are arguments for all 3, but relying on his Reddit QAnon fans to enact final piece of his plan while not even being able to celebrate activity seemed off imo. But it didn’t prevent me from enjoying finale I must admit.
  1. Rust
    March 7, 2022
    I enjoyed that because it excited me to see why. The way he smiles at Batman in the window as he's getting arrested was incredible and sent my mind whirling. What is he up to? His acting was top notch there. Loved Ave Maria too -- which was spooky for me as an inclusion, as I have a personal association with that song (as well as Batman) from a very young age...
    My expectation was a Hannibal Lecter sort of thing where he continues to manipulate and educate Batman on the bigger picture behind the safety of a bulletproof window, reinforced walls, and lots of guards. At this phase of his plan, he'd want that layer of protection as the chaos begins to ensue outside.
    So I thought he was looking for protection and, perhaps with a human face now, foster empathy from Batman. The conversation does start that way until he starts getting upset.
    His character falls apart for me when you realize his plan wasn't to unveil a greater conspiracy to Batman, a bigger picture, but just to... flood Gotham? It seems totally out of left-field, counter to his motivations and logic (in fact he is a massive hypocrite for it), and frankly just disappointing for all the build-up they were teasing to be more cerebral and focused on bringing justice to a systemically corrupt city.
    I liked the idea of him puppetting Batman into being his partner. He did horrible things to horrible people, but his goal was to get Batman to stop the bigger bad guys, so it was an interesting foil and suited the Edward I love from other mediums. I wanted to see that played out to it's logical crescendo.
    Instead, he just devolves into a generic babbling whining screaming psycho terrorist who wants to hurt innocent people en masse. Where did his MO go? Where did his composure go? His intelligence? His sense of justice? The conspiracy really stops at Falcone, then once Falcone dies, HE becomes the very kind of booeyman he was trying to fight? Why target the populace and not dirty cops and politicians and their masters anymore?
    And then we have him gawking and giggling at the Joker and his hammy dialogue. I don't know. I just don't buy that he was *that* kind of crazy in context with the rest of the movie, where he seemed more outraged and obsessed and hyper-intelligent. His brain melted and so did his plot. What a shame. He was written so well up to then.
    I loved him all the way up to the third act, and I had such hopes for him to really sell the climax, but he was the only sour spot of the climax. At least everything else was awesome.
    Perhaps he's not done and has a true bigger picture to reveal later, but they don't sell me on that in those last scenes.
    The cool idea would have been for him to be using his crusade on the Gotham PD and Falcone as a preview and discreet way to leave Batman sub-clues to a bigger threat of manipulation on a higher level than even Falcone - the Court of Owls. It would have fit with his logic throughout the rest of the film so much more than having him just have a weird emotional meltdown that he seems smarter than and tantrum bomb innocent people after spending the whole rest of the movie acting like he was fighting to avenge innocent people.
    Who knows? Maybe he faked that meltdown for some reason and we'll see why later.
    I'm trying to give Matt Reeves a way out there because I truly loved the rest of the movie.
    1. Drake Grayson
      March 7, 2022
      Excellent insight. The only thing I’ll say about his meltdown is that Reeves did establish his emotional nature and reactionary behavior throughout film imo. The way he attacked Mayor and communicated with Coulson seemed like a very unhinged emotional individual and if he honestly felt all along like Batman’s partner or puppeteer, the realization that Batman is not on board with his sociopathic mentality could very well cause him to break emotionally imo. As I mentioned in my take on film, I never saw Riddler. But I’m ok with the take and I feel he may evolve to more of the type of villain you and I are used to reading/watching in other media.
    2. Rust
      March 7, 2022
      I definitely see this, and I have the same feeling you do about them evolving him later on. I'm hoping he'll be a big part of the sequel. Paul Dano was fantastic.
      At the very least, he won't need the same kind of disguise anymore now that he's exposed himself, so I wonder what his new wardrobe might be.
      The problem I have is less with his meltdown itself, though. It's more with the contradictory nature of the final move he makes compared to the rest of his plan. It's a sudden inverse turn from his repeatedly stated mission goal that gave me whiplash. I don't feel it makes sense with everything leading up to it, nor does it lead to a satisfying climax of the establishing themes the Riddler represents and pursues that the movie spends it's first two acts engrossing us into seeing through to some kind of higher conclusion.
      Instead, his mission seems to be over with Falcone, and this bomb threat feels tacked on to facilitate a high stakes action-heavy finale, but out of character with his logic and mission goal.
      It would have been more impactful and climactic to have a large shocking revelation about the deeper seeded corruption in Gotham. Something bigger than anything we've learned yet. Something more cerebral and meaningful than, 'Yeah I decided to put some bombs around and kill everyone'.
      He sought justice and was using his intelligence as a weapon to expose injustice, and Batman as a weapon to defeat it. The climax should have been an extension of these themes culminating into something big and crazy along those lines. Instead, this path of justice-seeking and secret-exposing is abandoned after Falcone dies, and Riddler seemingly randomly just wants to commit genocide on a bunch of innocent people? Why?? Did I miss the why?
      My favorite Riddler adaptations are probably the BTAS take and Hush (not the animated one) in that he's more sophisticated and composed and a genius. Paul Dini writes him well in Sirens, too, and I think that skews closer to this in that he uses his brain for justice as a PI. A less comedic take on that tone would have been perfect in live action. And the shot of Zodiac and conspiracy they included here is the perfect way to make it compelling and threatening.
      Sorry to ramble. I'm sure I'm repeating myself. I love a lot of the new ideas they've woven into their version of him, but he trips over his own feet in the final act and I can't get past it.
      Maybe I need to watch it again.
    3. Drake Grayson
      March 7, 2022
      Oh I agree. Well said. I wonder if Reeves wanted Riddler to believe system and city were so broken that death and destruction were only acceptable way to end his lesson. Or perhaps a call back to his Justice riddle by the city finding violence at end. But yeah, you make excellent points and now I kinda wish we got a reveal like you envisioned too.
wei
March 8, 2022
i might be the minority here, but i'm tired of the Joker character in general. i didn't like Jared's version, or Joaquin's. wasn't a fan of the Jeremiah Valeska character either. there's a lot of choices in the Batman Universe for baddies to choose from. let's see someone we haven't seen before(in film) to go up against Batman.
1. mrsomebody
  March 9, 2022
  I'm with you. I'm dying to see Clayface and Manbat. Someone has to tackle the realistic style with the metahuman rogues

AnonymousHero

March 5, 2022

So initially, the Joker is the obvious character who it seems to be and now that Reeves confirms, I suppose it is.... UNLESS he's really throwing us off in a big way. Because after some thought a couple days removed from seeing on Tuesday, I truly believed it wasn't Joker and it was actually another Bat Rogues baddie instead:

The Mad Hatter.

He had the look for it and tried to throw people off with the little crazy laugh between him and Riddler, but with the character being done plenty of times and Barry Keoghan being practically the same height via canon, I was convinced it wasn't Joker at all. I honestly wouldn't put it past Reeves to do the ultimate "gotcha" this far in advance for his sequel and surprise everyone with this for a new villain for Batfilms, and if I'm right down the road, you heard it here first, but I can see Keoghan as Joker as well. Like most said, it doesn't need to be there but I guess he figured with 3 hours film, let me give a little extra something to look forward to.

All I know is, with all these pubescent characters that aren't their fully realized selves yet, I want to see Matt Reeves go six Batfilms deep, so we can enjoy a full trajectory of these characters developing into their full selves and then being fully actualized in Parts 4 through 6. By the end of a trilogy, it'll only feel at that point like we're just getting started.

da da da
March 5, 2022
It won't feel like a trilogy with all the HBO spinoffs !
1. AnonymousHero
  March 6, 2022
  That's true! It's just that Bats may not be in all of those, if any at all. I wouldn't expect it. So though it expands the world of Gotham through the villains character building, it might not expand the main adventures of Batman because it's too busy building the villains or GCPD up. At least Pattinson can have it on lock for a while on film instead of it being on to some other new guy years later after the trilogy. We can just keep it going every 3 years or so and build on an ongoing saga.
  1. da da da
    March 6, 2022
    Warner said the sequel will be released within 5 years.
    1. AnonymousHero
      March 6, 2022
      Considering other projects these guys take on, that's a safe window to mark it at. WB/DC were confident it'd be a hit out the gate and want to capitalize off it asap like they always do.

Pikashades

March 5, 2022

This movie was graphic novel of which script was sent to film director instead of an artist to draw into a comic. That's the best way I can describe it.

da da da

March 5, 2022

That scene distracted me from the main storyline and felt shoehorned IMHO. I really dig the Bermejo influence in The Batman but BK was really just a Bermejo Joker without the white skin and green hair (with A LOT of hair gel, wtf !?!) The laugh was ridiculous. Anyway, with so little shown, I give BK the benefit of a doubt (and time to improve his character).

That said, here's the way I see it for the eventual sequels :
Chapter 2 : The Joker still in jail in chapter 2, we see him planning something, meets with Dr Harleen Quinzel, the therapy goes horribly wrong for both of them.

Chapter 3 : the last inmate that Batman puts in Arkham is the key that makes possible the escape of everyone and Batman must face ALL the previous villain at once in a plan written by Joker.

Andy Lee

March 5, 2022

I like him in The Eternals. Great acting capabilities to be next Joker. But disappointed that Joaquin didnt make a cameo as Joker at asylum.

20170057

April 24, 2022

Hi looks terrible in The Batman.

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Matt Reeves discusses Barry Keoghan’s character in The Batman

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