Batman News Archive

I can understand not calling Batman Forever a sequel to Batman Returns... But how is Batman Returns not a sequel to Batman 89? It clearly is. Sure, it is its "own thing", but that's true for most sequels. Just because most comic book movie sequels are overly interconnected, doesn't mean they "have" to be, nor does it mean that when they're not, that they're suddenly not "true" sequels.

Mark
January 6, 2018
I'm with Seb. "Sequel" is a broad term that encompasses both direct continuations of the story, like "The Empire Strikes Back," and looser followups like "Jaws 2" or any of the horror movie series.
1. real
  January 6, 2018
  I agree that Returns does fit the wide net definition of a sequel. In the sense that it is next in a sequence of Bat films. You can't escape the umbrella term (pun).
  I don't agree that Returns is the same type of sequel TDK was to Begins.
  Sequel Type A (first film's themes carried through the second): In Begins, there is a explicit "to be continued" moment at the end, as well as many implicit plot threads that weave into the next film. If TDK were a in literary form, it would be the second book of a trilogy.
  Sequel Type B (same characters, new start point): Think of the James Bond films. If it were in literary form, it would be a new book, same characters, but not designed as a small portion of a greater thematic whole; much like a Sherlock Holmes story.
  If you dig behind the scenes of Returns, you get a clear picture that Burton is not interested in making a follow-up, but a fresh artistic installment with little to any follow-up on past plot threads. He hates sequels, so he's favoring sequel Type B.
  Besides all that definition masterbation, I really enjoyed this article. I do favor the idea of progressing DC films more in the style of the earlier Bat films. You've got me all excited! ENTIRELY NEW ADVENTURES ROCK!
  1. real
    January 7, 2018
    http://www.brand-wagon.com/...
    Serialized a bit more I thinks.
BatmanNewsChris
January 6, 2018
Yes, that's how I look at it too.
Ramboman24
January 6, 2018
I guess they're kind of like the Bond movies in the sense that you keep the same actors (Bond changes every once in a while) but each film just feels like the next installment rather than a direct sequel but I dunno...
While Batman returns did feel quite different from Batman 89 in it's own way it did reference the previous film although not much. But so many things were the same> Batman, Alfred, the Batmobile, the score to the point that it just felt like a sequel that didn't reference the previous film much.
I don't understand why they're going to distance themselves from the first Wonder Woman when it was so well recieved that sounds like a red flag for a big mistake.
To me, it's indicative of a massive tonal shift probably towards being more lighthearted not because of the way critics responded to WW (they loved it) but because WB probably want the next WW to be more profitable and they want to go full on Marvel with the sequel.
This is just their way of prepping the audience for the inconsistent tonal 180 they're about to pull. I'm guessing WB still hasn't learned a thing.
1. Ramboman24
  January 6, 2018
  I understand yours too. Batman Returns could easily stand on it's own especially since the original Batman didn't really establish much depth for any of it's characters. Both movies are kind of shallow in the storytelling 101 department. They're very straightforward films and you can tell they're made by someone that isn't interested in going in depth with themes and characters.
  1. BatfleckRules
    January 7, 2018
    I agree. I don’t mind that approach either. If that’s not what he set out to do then it’s perfectly acceptable. In fact, with Batman I just feel his origin story is best captured through vague flashbacks rather than in your face storytelling and depth. Because he’s such an iconic character, you run the risk of not making his origin seem as epic as it should be. That’s why to this day, I still prefer Year One to Batman Begins because it left more to the imagination and just gave us a glimpse. I just think that style lends itself better to a dark and iconic character like Batman it makes him more mysterious and adds that awe factor. If you take us thRough too much of Bruce Wayne’s life, step by step, trying to define it with too much detail it loses a little bit of that larger than life feel. I still love Batman
    Begins for giving us that detailed look we never got but overall I prefer Year One as the definitive look at Batman’s origin. I think Miller has more style than Nolan, whereas Nolan is all about detail.
ShobiNaq
January 6, 2018
I'm with Seb here. It's a sequel. I mean it has it in it's name. Batman... Then Batman Returns....
NinjaGamer13
January 6, 2018
Overly connected?
Frank
January 9, 2018
I agree with you! Batman & Robin is a Batman Forever sequel too.
Queef Police
March 9, 2018
gotham city was totally redesigned. The suit totally redesigned. ALMOST zero mention of the events of previous movie therefore not necessarily a direct sequel duh

Bats

Every film has a number and techically it will be Wonder Woman 2. However, I would say that Wonder Woman is following in the same footsteps of James Bond rather than the old Batman films.

The Turdinator

People are becoming too accustomed to the MCU way of telling stories not every single movie has to line up with a prior in the same Series in my opinion yes I would want some type of correlation to a sequel to the original but I do not care for same storyline or main plot points

John Johnson

Speaking of Tim Burton's Batman movies, this page is from Batman Vol. 4: The War of Jokes and Riddles...

I was very amused. :-)

MrMovies
January 6, 2018
I don't get it.
1. John Johnson
  January 6, 2018
  It's a scene from Batman (1989).
  https://youtu.be/Dj2rQaj25h4
  1. MrMovies
    January 6, 2018
    Thanks mate!
    1. John Johnson
      January 6, 2018
      You're welcome!
2. Hunter Zolomon
  January 6, 2018
  But aren't you a "big" DC and Batman "fan"? Surely you would know a reference to one of the most famous scenes from Batman 89?
  1. MrMovies
    January 6, 2018
    Do I know you?
  2. ShobiNaq
    January 6, 2018
    LOLLLL!
Neale7
January 6, 2018
Love it :-)
Hunter Zolomon
January 6, 2018
Yeah i loved that from when it was originally out.
The Walking Cuban
January 6, 2018
MIRROR!!!
ShobiNaq
January 6, 2018
Holy crap, I missed that reference. Man i havn't seen Batman 89 in a LONG time. I should re-watch it.

The Turdinator

Also, I LOVE batman returns the darkness is amazing

NinjaGamer13

As I said before, I think this is a cool, unique opportunity for the Wonder Woman franchise within the superhero genre.

Shunsui

The set up is Diana goes to work for the government just to find out that it has been secretly taken over
by the enemy for the last 50 years. So Diana and her bird themed partner and spunky spy love interest have to topple the agency they once worked for and bring their dirty secrets to light of day.

Dandare

"Wonder Woman 2" could start with Batman present day arriving to the Batcave on his Batmobile after cleaning of scum the streets of Gotham. Then Bruce meets Diana and she talks about what kind of life he is living. Diana tells Bruce a story of her past and the whole movie being a Wonder Woman flashback to the 80's URSS with a few cuts to the present day and an ending with a lesson to be learned by Bruce: All you need is love. :)

mr nobody

Weird article

Frank
January 9, 2018
Sequel or not sequel, true or false sequel... haha

OptimistPrime99

https://uploads.disquscdn.c... The only thing Patty Jenkins may have revealed in that interview, is that Etta Candy and other supporting characters, likely won't return for Wonder Woman 2. But regardless of the title, and year that it's set in, it'll be a continuation of Diana's journey...which would make it a sequel.

And yes, Batman Returns is indeed a sequel to Batman 89'. They were connected just enough, while allowing Tim Burton to go full Tim Burton in Batman Returns. Batman Forever was a studio-mandated tonal shift, with a new director and new Batman actor. Keaton, Kilmer, and Clooney are all supposed to be technically-basically, the same Bruce Wayne/Batman. But just like in comics, his look and personality gets to be rebooted, when a new creative team takes over. Same thing will happen after Batfleck. Not sure why Shumacher decided to swap out Dr. Chase Meridian, for the underdeveloped Julie Madison relationship. But Batman & Robin was so poorly written, it didn't even matter.

OptimistPrime99

Nightwing Fan J

Does anyone else not want another prequel movie? I want a movie set after Justice League so we can keep the supporting characters.

Hunter Zolomon
January 6, 2018
Yeah i want a post JL film as well, that means they can actually have her fucking fly instead of this jumping around they keep on having her do.

Hunter Zolomon

My main problem with a cold war setting is that BvS and then JL have made a point that Diana didn't do much hero stuff before BvS, ok JL said she done stuff in the "shadows" to try and fix the mess what BvS started but i can't imagine Diana won't have some big hero moments like No Man's Land in WW 2.

The Walking Cuban
January 6, 2018
I suppose it would have to be secret spy stuff she couldn't brag about. The Boring War, I calls it.
DudeofSteel1Million
January 6, 2018
BvS also had her as an experienced warrior saying stuff like "I killed things from other worlds before" (Ares isn't technically an "alien" so he doesn't count), so there's still a bit of wiggle room in regards to what kind of adventures she had between the first WW and BvS.
1. NinjaGamer13
  January 6, 2018
  I think the Olympian Gods WERE aliens, personally :P
NinjaGamer13
January 6, 2018
No Man’s Land was a single battlefield with just a few soldiers present from either side. Not exactly world-shaking stuff...

BatmanNewsChris

How is it clickbait or a poor comparison? The Batman movies were standalone stories that didn't have anything to do with each other, and that's the way the Wonder Woman franchise is going too. It's not "Wonder Woman 2" to Jenkins because it's not a follow up to Wonder Woman. It's just a brand new adventure with the same Wonder Woman actor.

BatmanNewsChris
January 6, 2018
But The Dark Knight was a direct sequel to Batman Begins.
My point here is that the Wonder Woman movies are going to be standalone movies about the same character, just like the Burton/Schumacher Batman movies were. Those were all about the same Batman, but they weren't direct sequels.
1. drisraelluna
  January 6, 2018
  not really... I think there was an animated film called gotham knight that relates to events that happen after BB and before TDK, so it is a very similar case to batman/batman returns... also, DKR is set years apart from TDK
  1. BatmanNewsChris
    January 6, 2018
    Yes but The Joker in BB carries over to TDK. TDKR is impacted by the ending of TDK. No story elements from Batman carried over to Batman Returns.
  2. Hunter Zolomon
    January 6, 2018
    Gotham Knight isn't canon to the Nolanverse, too much continuity errors and fantasy stuff for it to be in the Nolanverse. While The Dark Knight doesn't need a watch of BB it does carry on from it, Rises though is a sequel to both and needs a watch of at least one to understand whats happening in it as carries on plot elements from them both.

Daniel

It's kind of hard to watch the three Nolan films and then objectively say that they are *not* serialized. They are. Part III directly picks up on story points in Parts I and II. The whole Rachel Dawes storyline in Part II is a direct continuation of what came before in Part I.

Sorry, not buying your argument.

BugsMeany

TDKR was a traditional sequel. You could watch TDK not having seen Batman Begins, but the Harvey Dent fallout closely links the two Dark Knight films. Batman's long absence would have to be explained to someone watching it cold. Even the title depends on the previous film (what does he have to rise from?).

Ned Ryerson
January 7, 2018
Not to pad your ego too much, but thank you for genuinely getting this stuff and consistently understanding things with nuance rather than being a fanboy numbskull contrarian.
1. BugsMeany
  January 7, 2018
  Echoing those sentiments! Your comments are consistently engaging.
BugsMeany
January 7, 2018
He is beaten down and locked away during the film, yes, but he’s not exactly riding high when it begins.
I forgot about the BB/TDK footage being replayed. In that case, OK, I guess it can be watched cold. Certainly not the ideal way to watch but possible.

andrew

I do like the idea as it means the stories can be more simple and less muddled. But having a great character arc (like TDK trilogy) span over 3 movies is so satisfying. Villains don’t have to be connected, but rather than “just another adventure”, the story should feel like the 2nd step in her life, showing her progression and hinting at the end

Diego!

I really love the setting in the cold war, because it reminds me of The Americans.
Besides, by setting the movie in that era, Diana may do this :D

Bartholomew Hunt

You clearly don't understand what clickbait is, so maybe next time don't use those "fancy" words.

NinjaGamer13

Joker bit at the end of Batman Begins, TDK not giving any origin information on Batman, TDK’s ending leaving Batman’s future unresolved, TDKRises completely dependent on what was established in BB and TDK... How standalone!

Talia

I'm fine with no precise continuity. It's the same way with the DC animated movies right now isn't it? There're some references to previous stories (like the Son of Batman), you'd have to have some knowledge of previous characters and what they've done, but the movies don't have to all line up.

Nahuel Benvenuto

huh?

Mike 201

Don’t care as long as it’s as good as the first one it doesn’t matter.

UltimateEdition

this article is really reaching in its title.

Mike 201