Matthew Vaughn's 'Man of Steel 2' would be "a modern version of the Donner" Superman

September 18, 2017

Last week, Kingsman director Matthew Vaughn revealed that he has had talks with Warner Bros. about doing the next Superman movie. Collider followed up with him, and asked what his take would be if he were to take the job.

“Weirdly if I did do Superman—and I made the mistake of telling someone yesterday I have spoken about it and then wallop (laughs)," Vaughn admitted. "I think my main take would be, it’s really boring but make a Superman film. I just don’t feel a proper Superman—I think Donner did it to perfection for that time. Just doing the modern—I wanna do a modern version of the Donner [version]. Go back to the source material… For me Superman is color, feel-good, heroic. He’s a beacon of light in darkness. And that’s what I think Superman should be.”

Patty Jenkins has said many times that Richard Donner's Superman was inspiration for her Wonder Woman movie. Would you like to see Vaughn's modern version of that classic Superman in Man of Steel 2? Let me know in the comments below.

SOURCE: Collider

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353 comments

Schuyler Finley
September 18, 2017
As long as he doesn't make it too much like Donner's, I don't mind. Don't try to erase what's been done in MoS and BvS; build off of those two films.
1. Nick Farina
  September 18, 2017
  I think he just means bringing Superman back to his proverbial roots in the next solo film. Superman's "rebirth" in Justice League will hopefully be an excellent springboard to do just that.
  1. Schuyler Finley
    September 18, 2017
    I just don't want him to be like "See? This is the Superman 'we' wanted! Not the 'realistic' Superman that Snyder tried to sell to us".
  2. Jamesy
    September 19, 2017
    Can completemy see Vaugun injecting more colour, the blue a little bluer, the red a littler brighter etc. He could do the rebirth very well while serving as a soft reboot. I love Snyder, truly. But the angry "doesn't fit in" Supes needs to retire. Show the people, the audience, the critics...the hopeful Supes, the powerful Supes, the gleaming smile whilst rescuing a cat from a tree Supes. The same hopeful vibe WW had, borrow something from Captain America minus Hydra etc. Just a good man who's mission is to do good. Let Batman do the moping and Flash remind Bats how to smile, let Aquaman poke fun at Bats for being so serious and thinking it's dorky how serious he takes life, missions etc.
2. Schuyler Finley
  September 18, 2017
  A better writer can build off from even the most terrible of stories, and I'm not saying that MoS and BvS have bad stories. Just look at what happened with Ms. Marvel and the rape story. Instead of taking the easy way out and retconning or ignoring the whole ordeal, the writer instead chose to build off from the rape story and create a good story in the process.
  1. MrMovies
    September 28, 2017
    Retard
    1. MrMovies
      September 29, 2017
      It's clicked for many people, otherwise Man of Steel would be below 50% on RT.
      1. MrMovies
        September 30, 2017
        Moron
      2. MrMovies
        October 1, 2017
        Imbecile
      3. MrMovies
        October 1, 2017
        Asswipe
      4. MrMovies
        October 2, 2017
        Kys
      5. MrMovies
        October 2, 2017
        Kill yourself sweety
      6. MrMovies
        October 2, 2017
        You first cupcake.
      7. MrMovies
        October 3, 2017
        Ladies first.
      8. MrMovies
        October 4, 2017
        Kys
      9. MrMovies
        October 5, 2017
        Kys plz
      10. MrMovies
        October 5, 2017
        Please dude, die in a hole.
    2. AvengerRed
      September 30, 2017
      Personally I prefer Vaughn's take on Superman over whatever the hell we are getting from the DCEU.
3. Aheaney15
  September 18, 2017
  "throwing the score out the window and starting that over."
  That might be the one of the only times I respectfully disagree with you, even though overall I agree with your comment here. The score in my humble opinion was one of the best parts of Man of Steel. I thought Hans Zimmer breathed a lot of life into the genre. BvS on the other hand... Yeah aside from "Is She With You," the new stuff in the BvS score was pretty forgettable.
  1. Aheaney15
    September 18, 2017
    Ahhhh gotcha.
  2. Davonedoyle
    September 19, 2017
    i dont agree with forget part. we dont need to forget mos and bvs. we need to move on from it.
    1. Davonedoyle
      September 19, 2017
      hmm i agree. honestly i thought if clark had ptsd from killing zod and had to deal with those moral questions it wouldve have made bvs better. but since its past time now it wouldnt necessarily be beneficial to bring up the past. since superman is a new person now with a different mindset and way past noob level. i do agree with that.
  3. MrMovies
    September 28, 2017
    A Beautiful Lie was forgettable? The fuck outta here.
4. = ( ^___^) +
  September 18, 2017
  What are hey gonna do? Make Supes lose his powers again? 🙄
  Well WB had better do SOMETHING significant. With China owning most of Hollywood nowadays, if some enterprising Chinese director gets wind of the current Kenan Kong Super-Man, a studio there just might end up commanding special effects studios THERE into the type of recreation OF Supes that DC has been wrangling their brains over a decade about.
TheBlagueur
September 18, 2017
Great! Douchebag Sup is coming
Master Bruce
September 18, 2017
Can see a lot of hate in the comment section. We don't learn.We have to bash on every news which we dont want to here.
Mrlncredible
September 18, 2017
Dear Vaughn,
Man Of Steel, directed by Snyder, is heroic. No, I won't ever apologize for liking depth to a superhero film.
1. PizzaPlanet
  September 18, 2017
  Man of Steel , after watching enough superhero films (from dc & marvel)
  is One of the best .
  Snyder must comeback for this one
  1. Cisco007
    September 18, 2017
    MOS was a solid origin film. People who hate on it are nuts.
    1. Mark William Bedwell
      September 26, 2017
      Yeah, I actually like MoS, then again, I generally like the darker tone we've had with DC films. I like it wasn't trying to just copy marvel. BvS was playing catch up a bit and could of easily beensplit into two better films, but it is what it is what it is.
      I hope we see a new version superman, not a carbon copy of what's been before.
2. Knight-Errant
  September 18, 2017
  I don't know if I'd say "heroic", as much as having character depth (until the 3rd act). What I really like about MoS is how it conveys the burden of being Kent. Something I've talked with friends about for years. It illustrated why I wouldn't want to be him or have those powers.
  I think too many people don't want to see the burden & only want to see the perks. I've always found the perks to be boring.
  1. jrvc
    September 18, 2017
    I agree with everything minus the "not heroic" part. He did save a lot of people in both movies, but unfortunately people overlooked it just in favour of going along with a false criticism (not pointing this at you).
    He was a big hero and he showed it both in and outside the suit https://uploads.disquscdn.c...
    1. Knight-Errant
      September 18, 2017
      I can only speak for MoS, as I've only watched BvS once (though I wish they dropped the Batman stuff to give us more a sequel). The biggest complaints I've heard for MoS were: not going beyond telling people to stay clear in Smallville, the disregard for Metropolis, & Zod's death.
      Even though the Smallville battle seemed like a modern take of the Metropolis fight in Superman II, it seemed SuperReeve take more of a pounding saving people then SuperCavill did.
      Ultimately, I really only cared about the Kent stuff. By the time Zod came to Earth, I started losing interest.
      1. jrvc
        September 18, 2017
        I see your point, but really, that people still blames Superman for the fight when it was Zod doing leaves me annoyed. Can't they see how the fight went down? How Zod was throwing Superman everywhere? And he said he would destroy everything just to hurt Superman, so he couldn't bait Zod to go anywhere deserted.
        And lastly, that's what basically always happens in comics, so people made a big deal for a typical comics trope -_-
        Sorry for the rant, just talking in general but this topic always gets me, sorry
      2. Knight-Errant
        September 18, 2017
        There's another forum I'm on that I spent hours worth of posting defending MoS.
      3. jrvc
        September 18, 2017
        you and me both then ;)
3. Hunter Zolomon
  September 18, 2017
  "Superman is color, feel-good, heroic. He’s a beacon of light in darkness." Heroic sure but he sure ain't colour or feel good in the film. Most of the time with Cavil it feels like he would rather be doing something else then saving people what is something Superman should never be doing.
  1. Ezee23
    September 20, 2017
    That's on you. I didn't get that feeling. At all.
    I'm actually curious though, which parts gave you that feeling?
    1. Hunter Zolomon
      September 20, 2017
      He just looks bored and un-caring, maybe its Cavil's acting or Snyder's direction but i never get the sense that this Superman does what he does because he wants to.
4. = ( ^___^) +
  September 19, 2017
  It's better than Donner's.
Jerry Nice
September 18, 2017
There is SO MUCH amazing source material for Superman & yet all directors/actors/screenwriters tend to go back to the Donner films.
It was great for the times, but GEEZ! Can't we just get an original take that takes inspiration from the thousands of comics & the amazing animated version(s)?
1. Knight-Errant
  September 18, 2017
  I think he's referencing the tone & feel, not the actual storyline.
  1. Knight-Errant
    September 18, 2017
    Possibly. I recall defending Kent in MoS for "not being cheerful". I argued he was lost the beginning of the movie & trying to find where he fit in the world. He was understandably cranky because he didn't really know who he is.
    Since his (laughable) death in BvS, I speculate he will know his place in the world.
    1. Josh Morgan
      September 19, 2017
      ....laughable?
      1. Knight-Errant
        September 19, 2017
        Yup. I laughed at the ridiculousness of killing him off...by Doomsday, no less. The best was when hardo DC fanboys claimed it was "bold" to do so.
      2. Josh Morgan
        September 20, 2017
        but...Doomsday is the thing that kills superman...idk whatever bro
      3. Knight-Errant
        September 20, 2017
        What in the comic books? Yup, I remember when it was released. The movie version was corny. It had me laughing. Especially since there was no question he wasn't dead. Completely undercut the moment.
      4. Josh Morgan
        September 20, 2017
        well, i dont think you really get it but whatever. Opinions
      5. Knight-Errant
        September 20, 2017
        Oh I got it; it's not exactly Dante's Inferno. I just thought it was corny & weightless. There was no question he wasn't dead even before the ending moment. That's why I found it laughable.
      6. Josh Morgan
        September 20, 2017
        yes we know he is still alive but getting all emotional about him being dead and never coming back is not the point. Its about appreciating and understanding WHY he did what he did. His sacrifice wasn't about him no longer being alive. Its about what it means for his character development. Its not the end. Rather it is meant to represent the beginning. Snyder is a big believer in self sacrifice when it comes to superheroes. What we saw in BvS was sort of just the most extreme version of that.
      7. Knight-Errant
        September 20, 2017
        Still chuckling at it. Still felt weightless.
      8. Josh Morgan
        September 20, 2017
        well, thats your opinion
      9. Knight-Errant
        September 20, 2017
        No arguments here.
      10. Erotophonophiliac
        September 27, 2017
        To be fair, all hero "deaths" in superhero films are laughable and weightless, except for maybe Wolverine and Professor X in Logan because you just know those fuckers are in the advanced stages of decay. Everyone else from the entire genre just (surprise!) shows up half an hour later. It's retarded. It's like accidentally walking in on Bucky and Captain America having pent-up, aggressive buttsex. You can't say for sure it's happening, but as soon as you see it, you're immediately whispering "told you so" to the person sitting next to you.
      11. Knight-Errant
        September 27, 2017
        Ah, the first half of your post I'm in agreement with. The "accidental" part would have me stating "what are we doing here? Pandering to a few and pissing off the majority?"
  2. Cisco007
    September 18, 2017
    I hope!
2. nipple_pinchy
  September 18, 2017
  YESSSSS. Thank you.
3. Hunter Zolomon
  September 18, 2017
  The Donner films pretty much shaped Superman in the comics from 70s onwards though, even in Superman Rebirth right now there's a Donner vibe to it. People go back to it because its still the greatest version of Superman you can it what nails everything about him, Cavil is ok who could be much better under better direction but he never leave a mark on the character other then being a guy who played Superman for a few films.
  1. Tim Mysliwski
    September 19, 2017
    That is simply not true. Since crisis in the 80's Superman has been largely different from that Superman. He changed as did the colorings of his comics. And I don't get that feel at all with New 52 Superman or Rebirth Superman.
    Christopher Reeves Superman, if you guys watch this movie today, is not what you want in a Superman. He is soo cheesy. It does not fit with how we are now as a society.
    I'm all for them nerding up Clark, but what they have Superman wise right now is closer to the comics. (Very Close to New 52 Superman which was the Superman of Man of Steel times.) NEW 52 Superman was a younger version of the character and was very much like Snyder's Superman. He was emotional and had very emotional character building stories. Rebirth Superman is older and a father. But he is still not like Reeves' Superman.
    1. Hunter Zolomon
      September 19, 2017
      Is true, a lot of what Reeve's brought to the role DC added to Superman in the comics including his look and feel. Yes he's not the exact same but SM from that film on has been heavily based on a lot of what Reeve's done, DC have admited as much in the past including many of SM writers. All Star Superman what is considered by most the greatest Superman story in comics is pretty much Reeve's Superman in comic form.
      As for TN52 Superman, really are you trying to use him as a arguement? That version of Superman was hated so much that DC killed him off and gave us a more classic Superman (whose very much like Reeve in look and character minus the more cheesy elements, only need to read the family outing to the fair to see that) and then later on erased TN52 Superman from canon like he was never even there with most of his stories never even happening now.
      As for saying Rebirth Superman isn't like Reeve's SM i will say are you actually reading Superman and Action Comics? Because he's very much like Reeve's in character and design, there was a shot of him flying in one of the earlier issues and he was spot on for Reeve's and the way he acted in that was spot on Reeve's Superman.
      1. Tim Mysliwski
        September 19, 2017
        The Superman New52 is the Superman when this movie Universe was built.
        Rebirth Superman is NOT a Reeves adaptation. He is simply the Pre52 Superman reintroduced.
        You seem to be very heavily of the belief that Reeve's is very heavily a part of DC comic's Superman. It isn't, Reeve's is a mold from the old DC comics that hasn't been the same since the 70's. I've read everything since the 90's that Superman has published. The New 52 Superman and the Rebirth Superman are only like Reeves in comics because he was based off the basic mold of Superman. No the comics don't use anything from Reeves. they don't act like him, their Clark selves are not like him. If you've read or heard anywhere that any of that is true, it's probably just someone answering "Sure" to that question because Reeves was based off of the old Superman, and so was all comic Supermen in some way.
        You are giving Reeves far too much credit. For his time he did a solid job I'm sure, but he is not influencing every Superman since the 80's. And how on Earth is his design a Reeve's design?!?! and if someone made a drawing in comic that looked like reeves way of flying..... a lot of times artists do callbacks. To honor certain people. Also, how many ways of flying with Superman do you really think there are?
      2. Hunter Zolomon
        September 19, 2017
        I can't be fucked to reply to all of that but i will ask have you read any of the Golden Age Superman stuff or anything really before Reeve's? Because that SM was different to Reeve's in someways while post Reeve's the Superman we now know is more like him. Anyway i never said that the Rebirth SM is a carbon copy of Reeve's i said it has a Donner vibe to it and it does in his solo series, i'm not the only one whose noticed or commented on it, you don't see it well good for you.
thefallen83
September 18, 2017
Horrible idea. See "Superman Returns".
https://media.tenor.com/ima...
razorstar90
September 18, 2017
So Matthew Vaughn wants to make a Superman movie an actual movie about Superman?
People don't understand that Superman Returns is nothing like Donner's Superman movie. It was dreary, and broody, no fun or charm or action. It was just as "meh" as MOS was.
A Matthew Vaughn Superman movie would be WAY more successful then MOS
1. thefallen83
  September 18, 2017
  That's just your opinion. You can't come in here and state that as a fact. Sorry, not sorry.
  1. razorstar90
    September 18, 2017
    Yeah, well the opinion is very popular when it comes to MOS. The movie underperformed and got mixed to mediocre reviews. IF MOS was a huge hit BvS wouldn't have happened and we would have gotten a straight Superman sequel.
    besides, no one really like this current version. No one cared that he died. WB knows this which is why every superhero movie has been greenlit except for Superman.
    1. thefallen83
      September 18, 2017
      I don't have to agree or disagree with you, however one thing is for sure: You are generalizing.
      Good day.
    2. jrvc
      September 18, 2017
      I like this current version and made me a fan of Superman
    3. Новица Чворовић
      September 18, 2017
      dude you are clueless
      1. Kerk Lastnameless
        September 18, 2017
        No, he is right.
      2. Alan Conn
        September 18, 2017
        No he is not.
      3. Wagner Von Schmit
        September 19, 2017
        IF MOS was a great hit BVS would of not happened.
      4. Новица Чворовић
        September 19, 2017
        no he is wrong, and people like he and you can fuck off to watch some talking trees if you don't like it, or you have blu-rays and go watch that 70s Superman parody.
      5. Kerk Lastnameless
        September 19, 2017
        And you can go buy yourself some Superman comics, cause you don't know jack shit about Superman. And you also can fuck off.
2. Schuyler Finley
  September 18, 2017
  Huh?
  MoS was a film about Superman...........
  1. razorstar90
    September 18, 2017
    MOS was a film for people who hate Superman. Which is why it was so polarizing.
    1. Knight-Errant
      September 18, 2017
      Because it was different. I recall one of the big complaints about Superman Returns was it was too much like Donner's version. People wanted a different take.
      After MoS, I've gotten into several conversations with people who disliked to Donner-copy of Returns, but was turned off MoS didn't copy it.
      1. Mark
        September 18, 2017
        Singer was basically doing an homage to Donner, to the point that the actors were constrained to try to replicate Reeve's and Hackman's performances (not so much Margot Kidder's). But to take that world, assume the audience was up-to-date with 30-year-old movies, and then not only stick Superman with a deadbeat dad storyline but "up the ante" by finishing with a MOUNTAIN OF KRYPTONITE! A MOUNTAIN I SAY! was just a series of really poor choices. At least Brandon Routh got to make a joke about it in the CW crossover last season.
      2. Knight-Errant
        September 18, 2017
        I don't know if assuming the world is up to date on a 30 year old movie was a gamble. Up to Returns, that was THE Superman movie. Both Raimi & Nolan cited it for their superhero movies.
        It's also why there really wasn't any surprise to who was Jason's father.
3. Новица Чворовић
  September 18, 2017
  no it wouldn't because nobody is interested in that Superman
4. Kouglof
  September 19, 2017
  MoS was "meh" ? It does not compute.
Новица Чворовић
September 18, 2017
nobody wants that, vaugh just don't get it, nobody wants rehased version of Superman that failed once, if Zack is not returning for MoS 2 get J.A. Bayona
SJ1986
September 18, 2017
Instead of the usual negative BS...
What would people love to see in an MOS sequel? Villains, storylines etc.
1. Schuyler Finley
  September 18, 2017
  Superman facing Mongul in Battleworld
  1. SJ1986
    September 18, 2017
    I was thinking the same but worried now that it would be too similar to Thor: Ragnorak!
    1. Schuyler Finley
      September 18, 2017
      Just say fuck it. Let's have Supes tested on having to rely on his own skills and not his powers.
      1. Mark
        September 18, 2017
        He doesn't really have any. That's one of the things MoS picked up on: that Clark Kent would never have learned how to fight someone, because he never needed to. So when Zod showed up, trained as a warrior from the womb, he pretty much mopped up the floor with Clark until the Matrix was destroyed and he lost it.
2. Schuyler Finley
  September 18, 2017
  I disagree. Involving Brainiac will most likely result in MoS 2 changing to JL 1.5. And Metropolis shouldn't get fucked for the third straight time.
  1. Rust
    September 18, 2017
    I think framing it around the concepts of the Geoff Johns Brainiac story would cement it as a Superman story - and a very iconic one, with a strong philosophical foot forward from Superman as a character. The way he ends things with Brainiac in that story, what he says to him... *so* good.
    It would also be the ideal opportunity to introduce Kara (Supergirl) to the DCEU, and explore the entertainingly over-protective side of Clark's personality brought out by her.
    You know what? More Clark. I love Clark.
    ... It would be so amazing if Clark and Bruce had some coffee at Ma Kent's, if we were to include an outsider cameo. Maybe Bruce is just checking up on him, and gets called away on something important (explaining his lack of involvement with stopping the invasion).
    "So, you're probably wondering who this is. I found out that I... have a cousin."
    "...Are we talking Earth-cousin, or...?"
    "Hi! I'm Kara! (crushing handshake)"
    "(grimacing a little) ...I see."
    And of course Martha would definitely be all smiles to have him as a guest after BvS. That would be a warm scene for sure. :) Pardon the tangent.
I'm Batman Man 39
September 18, 2017
Didn't we already get this with Superman Returns?
1. zofloc
  September 18, 2017
  The same way The Usual Suspects was half shot in a single room. Hmm.
2. KelVintage1
  September 19, 2017
  Haha!
PizzaPlanet
September 18, 2017
I knew it will be boring
go the F*** away
let Snyder do his Job
1. razorstar90
  September 18, 2017
  ruin another superhero movie?
  1. PizzaPlanet
    September 18, 2017
    go watch the smurfs kid
    1. EverGreen
      September 18, 2017
      Or better yet.... WW a third time and beyond! Marathoning with Netflix's Daredevil, Defenders and Dredd. Because... Why not?
      1. PizzaPlanet
        September 19, 2017
        Watched all of them - not just a Dc fan,
        But MoS , 300, watchmen are the Best adaptation on screen
      2. EverGreen
        September 19, 2017
        That's debatable.
      3. PizzaPlanet
        September 25, 2017
        Dude
        They are literally comics coming to life
        whats to debate?
      4. EverGreen
        September 25, 2017
        Reffering to them as "the (absolute) best". Visually, they may be, but as you probably know, visuals don't make a movie. Objectively, the rest such as execution, script, pace, dialogue, etc... is mostly hit-or-miss, and I state that as both a fan and a reader.
        If we consider all those factors, there are better.
2. Kerk Lastnameless
  September 18, 2017
  Make DC the laughing stock of Hollywood on par with Transformers?
3. EverGreen
  September 18, 2017
  What if he doesn't want to come back after all?
Sense
September 18, 2017
As long as he doesn't go all Bryan Singer it should be okay. Just avoid anything and everything Singer did.
Joe K.
September 18, 2017
Stay away from it Vaughn with that sissy shit
razorstar90
September 18, 2017
Nolan used Donner's films as a reference. Kevin Feige said that the Donner films are the point of reference for all the Marvel movies as well.
Dark Vador
September 18, 2017
Can't we just do something else than Donner ? It is not the only version of Superman.
There is so much comics, he should know.
Nick Farina
September 18, 2017
Singer's Superman Returns had no idea what it wanted to be. It had too many plot holes to be a proper sequel to Donner's Superman, yet went out of it's way to appear to exist in that universe. I do think there is a way to find a happy medium between Man of Steel & Superman:The Movie and I think that's what Vaughn is talking about here. That is, finding that elusive middle ground for Superman.
thefallen83
September 18, 2017
The problem with you all is that you hate change.
1. Knight-Errant
  September 18, 2017
  Until you don't get it.
2. Kouglof
  September 18, 2017
  I really appreciate change, so I don't want to come back to Donner/Singer movies.
residentgrigo
September 18, 2017
What does this even mean and how much has Returns lost again? We´ll see. Let´s maybe get a director signed first... The first 2 films were on to something though, sharp edges and all.
They also went though behind the scenes insanity that make the DCEU look like a clockwork.
1. Knight-Errant
  September 18, 2017
  That's kind of weighted. Returns had to carry the expenses of all the failed attempts up to that point. If it would've had a clean slate like MoS, there probably would've been a sequel.
  1. residentgrigo
    September 18, 2017
    MoS also had to carry debt into it´s budget and Returns has a bewildering opening scene on Krypton that was deleted and ended up costing 10 mil. They were spending money like no tomorrow regardless.
    1. Knight-Errant
      September 18, 2017
      What was MoS carrying in & how much? I don't recall reading that before.
IamTheOneWhoKnocks
September 18, 2017
That is awesome.....so much great news lately. I haven't been this excited to see DCEU movies since pre-BvS. Great time!
Daniel Dion
September 18, 2017
If the modern version of donners superman is similar to Wonder Woman's tone and themes. Then I'm all for it. Not interested in superman returns 2
Jason_Fallen_Son
September 18, 2017
Cool.
residentgrigo
September 18, 2017
While we are talking about who modern Superman is and who he should be. This is what goes on in Action Rebirth right now: https://pre00.deviantart.ne...
Reminds me of a certain Snyder film, or two... and this ain´t a dream sequence. Long story short. Jor-El is seemingly alive and ended up instigating a genocide to show how worthless humans are to Sups.
1. Hunter Zolomon
  September 18, 2017
  Worth pointing out both Superman Rebirth and Action Comics are giving us a Reeve's/Donner type Superman and us readers are loving that, character wise this Superman is really not like Cavil and both comics don't feel like Snyder's films at all.
  As for the "Jor-El" reveal well i think its clear this isn't the Jor-El we know or even Jor-El at all. Considering Mr Oz has ties to Dr Manhattan i wouldn't be suprised if its all a play to get Supes to doubt himself, i mean its funny how both Bats and Supes Father's have came back against all odds and are telling their sons to stop being who they are. There's also other things going on with Wonder Woman and the Lanterns and Flash what hint that Dr Manhattan is doing stuff to them and behind certain events to make them doubt themselfs.
2. J.K.2019
  September 19, 2017
  Time to snap his fathers neck, Huh?..
Seb
September 18, 2017
I know people will hate me for saying this, but I don't care... with these comments alone, Vaughn proves he "gets" Superman more than Snyder ever will. Not to mention, he's 10 times the director he is. And I honestly cannot believe people are seriously suggesting MoS was a "deep" film. It's riddled mindless action and its narrative was hardly noteworthy. Superman is NOT brooding. He's not any of the things Snyder turned him into. No, I don't want a corny "always smiling" Superman either. But that's why Vaughn says he'd do a MODERN take on that version of the character. Fans are so damn pretentious when it comes to Snyder and his provably failed "vision". You need to accept that and let someone with actual talent and understanding of the character take over.
1. jrvc
  September 18, 2017
  Have nothing against what Vaughn said nor your opinion, but after reading many modern comicbooks of Superman, I can say Snyder did get Superman right, only another version and not the one from Donner's time.
  Just take a look at Birthright, All Star or For All Seasons and the similarities are there
  1. Seb
    September 18, 2017
    I mean, I can sort of see New 52 (and even then I have a hard time seeing similarities, cause New 52 has always been kind of a dick, whereas Snyder's Superman isn't, but he's reckless and ignorant all the same). But Birthright? All Star? I may not have read too much into Birthright admittedly, but All Star is literally to polar opposite of everything Snyder pushed for. Tbh, I can't imagine a more different take than All Star.
    1. jrvc
      September 18, 2017
      hmm, IMO I think new52 is not that similar, but all star was, just look into the part where he "is" in Krypton and talks to Jor-el. That part was almost literally copied into the movie. And Luthor's deranged take was also taken from there.
      Birthright totally was the most influencing, I think, regarding how he was alienated at first and the doubts he carried with all that.
      These books opened my eyes more to Snyder's version. If you can read them, maybe you could see all that too ;)
      1. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        Luthor taken from All Star? Don't you mean Birthright? (And even then, I wouldn't agree, because that's looks only. Birthright Luthor - personality wise - is still nothing like Jessi Eisenberg's version).
        All Star Lex is the same old Lex we've known for decades. I don't see how that version influenced Snyder's take, if at all.
        And the Krypton part may have resembled the film (I honestly don't remember), but I'm talking about the overall character of Superman in that storyline. Not one specific scene, and I'm sorry to say it, All Star bares almost no resemblance to what Snyder was doing, unfortunately. In MoS, there were glimmers of hope, no pun intended... but for some reason I cannot fathom, BvS Superman was stripped away from all his good characteristics. All Star Superman was confident, wise, kind and strong. None of these things can be said about Snyder's Superman in BvS.
      2. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        But in BvS, Superman was confident, strong, and wise in his own way. Instead of following along with Perry's orders, he chose to focus on how Batman's rampage is affecting citizens. Superman was confident, but throughout the film he started to doubt himself more and more. And as for kind, he's still choosing to save people despite the media painting him as an enigmatic deity.
        And with All-Star Superman, Superman was WAY more experienced than DCEU Superman.
      3. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        "But in BvS, Superman was confident, strong, and wise in his own way."
        Good joke. I'm sorry, I just can't take this seriously.
      4. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        But he was. You're comparing one character who has a crap ton of experience under his belt to another character who's at year 2 or 3 of being a superhero.
      5. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        Doesn't that prove my point that he wasn't like those versions though?
      6. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        In a way, yes. DCEU Superman is not AS kind, confident, or strong as All-Star Superman.
      7. Reverse_Flash
        September 18, 2017
        Don't take anything he says seriously. He's one of the blindest and most biased fanboys around this place.
      8. jrvc
        September 18, 2017
        No no, I know birthright had the mad scientist Luthor with Eisenberg looks, but I was talking about madman Luthor from All-Star, just from the scene in the prison we can see where Snyder got inspiration for Eisenberg's jail scene.
        But now that I come to it, I think it's better to say BvS Luthor is an amalgam of those two.
        We will have to agree to disagree for the rest though, as I'm quite sure that there were all those glimmers of hope with this Superman too Just count all the times the word hope is pronounced
      9. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        Ever heard of "show, don't tell"? That's basically what's wrong with Snyder's Superman. I mean, in the JL trailer, Bruce says how Superman was a beacon of hope, and made everyone see the best parts of themselves. Like really? He's seriously saying that after the events of BvS, when the entire world basically crucified him? In BvS, everyone is shown to hate him. And even though they SAY (and not show) that "not everyone shared that opinion", it doesn't matter, because once again, it breaks the number one rule of storytelling. It's simply not enough to SAY he inspires hope. They have to actually show it, and they never did.
      10. Aheaney15
        September 18, 2017
        Thank you! Finally somebody acknowledges that the movies fail to show how "inspiring" the DCEU Superman ever was. Hell, his coolest achievements are in the articles in that one shot of the dude planning to tag the Superman statue in BvS (him shifting a plate tectonic, foiling a crime, saving an Ecuadorian village from a volcanic eruption, etc) AND WE DIDN'T GET TO SEE ANY OF THEM.
        Don't get me wrong, I'm all for a darker version of Superman that has to come to grips with this world reacting badly to him. But you highlighted the exact reason why Cavill's Superman doesn't entirely work.
      11. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        But we did.
      12. Aheaney15
        September 18, 2017
        No, we really didn't. Most of the time Superman has been shown in a negative light to the public.
      13. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        Check above. And people were treating him as a god as he was saving them.
      14. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        But Batman is the prime example of being inspired by Superman. And Metropolis even had a statue of him, and let's not forgot all of the people who went to his funeral.
      15. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        That's what you lot say... but again, did they actually SHOW that in the film? At best, they yet again merely said it, and that is not even true. I don't buy that for one damn second. You never actually saw Bruce being inspired by anything whatsoever. The only reason you're saying he was, is because the synopsis for JL says he is. It's pretty sad, frankly.
      16. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        .......Remember his "men are still good" speech to WW?
      17. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        "Show, don't tell". You obviously don't know what that means. And how the hell is going to a funeral proof of Superman "inspiring hope"?
      18. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        There is a thing called "doing both". Snyder even used his typical imagery to SHOW Bruce's change.
        Well if millions hated him but come to mourn at his funeral, I think it's safe to say that those people were inspired by his sacrifice.
      19. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        Snyder did no such thing, and you know it. Seriously, point to me at which moment in the film Superman actively inspired Bruce, or any other person for that matter? The fact that it took for him to die to supposedly inspire anyone, doesn't exactly help your argument. If anything, it proves my point that he didn't achieve shit while he was alive. And the funeral thing is more so a sign of respect, than "inspiring hope". Not to mention, it's just extremely sanctimonious. As if I'm supposed to believe the entire population suddenly cares so much about an individual they were tearing down the previous day? It's just bad, no matter how you slice it.
      20. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        But he did. In Wally's room, we see his wall covered in newspaper articles all about Superman's heroics between MoS and BvS. Even Perry called that period a "homeymoon". And history has shown that people are very quick to turn against an inspiring figure. In Biblical terms, this happened to Jesus.
        And as someone had posted in an early article on here, when Bruce was walking to his parents' graves, he was in a desolate area. There was no clear path for him. However, after the funeral, he had a clear path to walk through amongst the fields.
      21. Aheaney15
        September 18, 2017
        That's not showing. That's vaguely alluding at best.
      22. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        Not really vague if the newspapers are telling you exactly what's been going on.
      23. Aheaney15
        September 18, 2017
        But the shot isn't very long. You have to pause to see any of them. I'd file the newspaper shot as more "Easter eggs" than actually showing Superman being a symbol of hope. Making a little shot of a guy's achievements on newspapers isn't showing in the "show don't tell" sense. Actually showing the person doing said achievements is.
      24. Schuyler Finley
        September 18, 2017
        But we also get that in the montage.
      25. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        No matter how garbage the Transformers movies are... at least you see Prime INSPIRING his autobots, without them having to literally state they were moved by his words or actions. That's how bad BvS pulled that off. As if I'm supposed to care, simply because the movie tells me to. Sorry, but it doesn't work like that.
      26. Seb
        September 18, 2017
        I mean, you said it yourself... "SPEECH" to WW. As in; DIALOGUE. Or TEXT.
      27. jrvc
        September 19, 2017
        But they actually showed it, for example the ending gathering, or Bruce recovering his faith. Also, remember that movie move around a debate, whether Superman is a good thing or not. There wouldn't be a debate if there weren't people on both sides, don't you think?
        Also:
        https://uploads.disquscdn.c...
      28. Seb
        September 19, 2017
        Again, they say, or at least imply there are people on both sides... But you never truly see any of them. And that picture does nothing for me.
      29. jrvc
        September 19, 2017
        Disagree, I saw both parts in the TV programs and debates. Or is it that you wanted that a huge chunk of the movie dedicated to that? Because then people would have complained about too much blah blah and little superheroics.
        And that picture gives examples of those things you say there aren't in the movie. Now if you want to ignore them... then we will have to agree to disagree. For MoS started that modern "Donner's" version and I'm sure JL will be the ultimate realization of that
      30. Seb
        September 19, 2017
        As always, love chatting with you (because you're just way too nice of a guy, I just don't get it), but we have to agree to disagree, as usual.
        One thing though, I hope you're right with JL, and I think you will be. And if the rumors are to be believed, than Superman will be even more confident, and more heroic than initially thought. Because apparently, they cut Superman doubting himself yet again out of the film and replaced it with some other scene not relating to his inner struggles at all. I was bored when he struggled in BvS (but I sort of accepted it, because I do know what they were trying to do)... but I don't want any more of that in JL. It's time for him to freaking shine.
      31. jrvc
        September 19, 2017
        Thanks pal, same to you. The thing is that I come here to discuss about things I'm passionate about with people who are the same as me, but if I start trolling or fanboying where the heck is the discussion? There's no point or fun in that.
        I wish most people were like you, who we can discuss different points of view with (unless it's Amber Heard, we always agree on that XD), but then there are idiots like that abxincoc or whatever his name is. I can tell I'm not very nice with that troll ;p
        I'm not going to say I'm 100% sure that JL is going to be just like I'm imagining it, but I've always followed the interviews with Snyder, Terrio and Co. and they have said since before BvS that that was the plan, so I doubt they aren't doing that now, don't you think?
      32. Nightcrawler33 is abkinxoc
        September 23, 2017
        abkinxoc changed his name to Nightcrawler33 and set his history to private after he was exposed as Kenton Morales, a single, 37-year-old loser who stays up all night insulting people.
        Remember that name change next time he starts s***.
Nahuel Benvenuto
September 18, 2017
A better director would be nice, or better yet, just keep Snyder
1. EverGreen
  September 18, 2017
  Oh mejor aún, alguien mejor que Snyder. 😄
jrvc
September 18, 2017
For all the people saying we didn't get that with Snyder I'm just thinking that we are going to get that with JL if we take into account what he himself has always said he would do with the character.
Oh well as long as they don't retreat too much everything will be fine!
Diego!
September 18, 2017
Yes please! Watching the original Superman in the drive-in inside my uncle's car when I was four years old (it was a re-run), it's one of my earliest and most beloved memories. What a movie. I absolutely love Superman The Movie and Superman II. He was the light that guided us and it's great to see that Matthew Vaughn wants to make a movie like that. Count me in to watch it in a pre-release event :D
Black Adam
September 18, 2017
Cool. If he thinks he can adapt it to modern time, yeah, I'm all for it. It's time for Henry to smile a bit.
Cisco007
September 18, 2017
Vaughn making a carbon copy of Donner/Reeves Superman is NOT the way to go! Taking inspiration is fine...but relying too much on remaking Donner Supes and relying on nostalgia would be just plain lazy. Much Abrams did with Force Awakens.
1. dugzino
  September 18, 2017
  Wasn't Abrams fault. Wasn't he who wrote TFA. Let's see what he does with SW:IX.
  The one he'll direct AND write. Abrams did an amazing job with Star Trek.
  TFA was a disaster, story wise. And the thing that I hated the most in it, it wasn't the childish Death Star comparison but why even in this fantasy universe, black people are the black people we know? That cliché, I hated it.
  1. Cisco007
    September 19, 2017
    Actually Abrams was involved in rewriting FOA with Kasdan after Lindelof was fired. Abrams will do the same with last SW Ep9 film. First Abrams ST was good...the 2nd one was not.
Cisco007
September 18, 2017
People who say Snyder's/Cavill's Supes was not "heroic" in MOS and BvS do not have any credibility as far AS I'm concerned! He saved millions of lives and the whole world even.
That Guy
September 18, 2017
It's times like this I wonder: What would've Tim Burton's Superman movie been like?
1. Knight-Errant
  September 18, 2017
  A Bruce Wayne cameo surrounded by a lesser character.
  Interviewer "you played one of the greatest superheroes of all time."
  Michael Keaton "no, I played THE greatest superhero of all time."